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Sunday, February 27, 2011

Smarter than Langer

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6 comments:

  1. Roger Bishop JonesFebruary 28, 2011 at 1:13 AM

    So who is this JL?

    Lady Welby?

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  2. Luigi SperanzaFebruary 28, 2011 at 3:55 AM

    Yes. I used her title in the label: "Lady Welby" and I add an odd implicature:

    "who should have influenced Grice". The way I use 'should' I always implicate (and explicate on occasion) that it's not a non-factive:

    "Peter should be the best; and he is!"

    --- Since there is controversy as to whehther would have joined Bertrand Russell in his rather ungenteel comment, (to the effect), "I knew of her but perhaps failed to appreciate her") we trust Grice shouldn't!

    She was a striking beauty.

    The phrase 'smart' is ambiguous. It can mean 'beautiful', and I mean it that way. Also 'stylish' and I mean it that way. Also 'cleverer' and I mean it that way, with caution, when I compare it to Suzanne Langer. (Of Langer I also append a photo, in a later post -- and refer to this as a 'fashion statement'. Langer was perhaps more 'intellectual', but the way she dismisses the meaning of "London" is both un-Griceian and un-Cockney!)

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  3. Luigi SperanzaFebruary 28, 2011 at 3:56 AM

    I'm fascinated that you, Roger, live next to "Welby". "-by" is possibly Scandinavian. I suppose her family had connections with the place (or otherwise -- the place had connections with her -- but 'connect' is reciprocal, no?).

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  4. Roger Bishop JonesFebruary 28, 2011 at 8:43 AM

    So much for my powers of observation.
    I didn't even notice that the picture had a title (apart from the title on the message).

    I went off to recover the original passage in Russell in which he was not impressed by Lady Welby but have been unable to rediscover it.

    However, the connection with Welby was through her marriage (1863) to Sir William Welby-Gregory, 4th Baronet, who was an MP for Grantham (about 7 miles east of here) and then for South Lincolnshire.
    Welby is between here and Grantham.
    The country seat of the Welby's is at Denton, which is about 5 miles south-west of Grantham, so I guess the Welby in the name is the same as our neighbouring village.

    The -by probably came with the angles, we are after all, almost in East Anglia.

    Roger

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  5. Luigi SperanzaFebruary 28, 2011 at 9:01 AM

    Good to know. Yes, I would think, I think it is spelt: Danelagh. I.e. the idea that -by is short (or Viking) for -borough. Thus, just by travelling England and environs, you can stick with "DerBY", but also with "RugBY", and also with "ScarBOROUGH", which should be, ScarBY, and then there's MiddlesBROUGH, which should be Middlesby, and Edinburgh, which should be Edinby, and so on.

    Oddly, the wiki entry for H. Cust, who married Lady Welby's daughter ("Nina") apparently had sex with a great aunt of Margaret Thatcher, if I read the thing correctly. Indeed, I provided little evidence for Cust having been a 'rake', in the words of the wiki. So that's one alleged piece of evidence.

    We should get a visual of that "Manor" that Welby hosted (Lady Welby I mean). Apparently it was excellent to hold those 'literary' and 'cultural' soirees.

    The Russell quote is cited by Dale in the body of his PhD, or a footnote, to ch. ii. He (Russell) is not strictly saying that Lady Welby's ideas 'failed to impress' him, but rather the idea of having anything useful to say about 'meaning'. This is in his review of Ogden and Richards.

    Now, when Constable was... But I'll post this and divide...

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  6. Luigi SperanzaFebruary 28, 2011 at 9:04 AM

    Now, as I was saying, when Constable was looking for material on Grice and Ogden and Richards, he 'found' the Dale reference (or found if you must, :)) and the result is that glorious Grice is cited in that reprint.

    But one has to be slightly careful. Apparently, from what I read in Dale, it was mainly OGDEN that was responsible for that book ("Meaning of Meaning") -- and yet Constable was editing RICHARDS' publications.

    It is fascinating: Ogden, his figure. His loyalties with Welby changed over time, and he is also the link with Witters who he translated. I should say I am, for some odd reason, more familiar with the work of Richards.

    But both were fascinating characters. Incidentally, since Grice did read Stevenson, Ethics and Language (1944, Yale) and this book makes at least one mention of Ogden and Richards, as I recall, it is natural to suppose that Grice came across that quote, too. This in connection with what Grice read, what he heard, and what he wrote. Etc.

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